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I take it that nobody was overawed with the budget...


Quickbeam

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Well I for one will be at least £2 a year better off with the penny off beer tax.

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john bunyan

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1st in = is

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cream.

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The public's reaction to the budget and how the coalition is doing will show in May's local elections.

Lets face it, all the 3 main contenders will be bricking it.

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spider9

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fourm member *" The optimist in me would like to think it wasn't that."*

....but really you know it was, I presume!!

(But it's good to hear there is an optimist in there!)

The point of the 'small' pushback was so that a small decrease could be announced rather than a small (but embarrassing )increase. Silly smoke and mirrors. But, as I said, we are gullible.

john bunyan

Whilst agreeing we are in big trouble, I fail to see the logic in your contention that we must "raise taxes and cut expenditure". The only way out of this mess is to get growth, and people in work, paying taxes not claiming welfare. People will not have jobs if others are not spending.

It now seems that the government are saying it's not their fault that none of their targets promised have materialised, it's due to external worldwide problems - yet they still repeat their fixed mantra about the original problems being caused by the last government (not a worldwide banking crisis!).

They are like two sets of kids in a playground, calling each other names - Oh for some half decent political minds.

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john bunyan

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spider9

"The only way out of this mess is to get growth, and people in work, paying taxes not claiming welfare. People will not have jobs if others are not spending."

Agreed, but how, without borrowing more (which would move us towards a "Greek" situation, higher borrowing costs and many other problems)?

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spider9

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john bunyan

It appears that since the chosen method for 'recovery' is austerity, it will take ten years or more to even hope to reach a conclusion - by which time we'll have lost a generation of young people and our savings will have been hit far harder than the prospective 10% 'haircut' in Cyprus.

The only difference will be that we won't have a dramatic demand for our savings, they will simply be eaten away (already our £s have lost about 25% due to QE and currency fluctuations in the recent past!).

It may well take some bold moves by politicians, unfortunately I see little evidence we have any!!

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fourm member

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'some bold moves by politicians'

Surely the problem is that bold moves by our politicians would just be matched by similar moves by other countries because we're all chasing the same limited demand in the world economy.

A large part of the reaction to the budget has focussed on the reduced growth forecasts indicating that we are still obsessed by that one aim.

It seems to me that the only way to a brighter future is to find a way to be comfortable with doing more for less rather than chasing the aim of continuous growth.

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spider9

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"... with doing more for less "

So is the solution for everyone in the country to accept an immediate, say 10%, reduction in all pay and benefits, and dividends and bonuses?

Do we stop buying new clothes/cars and maybe repair what we have (as in post war years)?

Bold moves...?

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fourm member

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Trying to define our economic position from exchange rates is wide open to political spin.

Spider9 says the £ has lost 25% but, since the beginning of 2009, the £ has risen against the Euro by 11%. However, if you start late in 2008 you can show the £ has fallen 19%.

Not only does the choice of start date make a great deal of difference but by being vague 'in the early days of the downturn' you can claim the £ is up or down depending on what political point you want to make.

Any politician making a point based on exchange rates should be viewed with suspicion.

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spider9

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fm *" Trying to define our economic position from exchange rates is wide open to political spin"*

I was certainly doing no such thing, merely pointing out the way that savings can be affected by other means than a political 'grab' on peoples actual bank accounts.

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oresome

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Business and economies are focused on growth and we were used to, until recently, a continually rising standard of living.

Not only that, growth and modest inflation helps to service the previous debt incurred.

A rising world population and growing living standards fuels the growth, but there is a limit to the natural resources available to meet the ever increasing demand.

Perhaps sooner or later we will have to adopt a different economic model with growth not being an objective, but I can't see it happening anytime soon.

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