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Israel and the Gaza strip
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Posted November 19, 2012 at 7:00PM
This seems an intractable problem. The Israelis will not allow ships etc to go to Gaza as they fear smuggling of arms and rockets. Hamas responds by smuggling through tunnels from Egypt.The whole Palestinian embryo State has been seeking statehood for years but even they cannot show a united front. The Israelis continue to build in disputed land. Iran stirs it up in the background. The Israeli response to rocket attacks is disproportionate. The whole thing could get out of hand. Talks seem a waste of time as each side loathes the other. How depressing; there seems little hope for peace in our time.
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Posted November 20, 2012 at 8:31PM
fourm member
This is a first. You quoting Fox news as a source for unbiased news.
How would you expect the UK to react if the Falkland Islands were to be constantly bombarded with missiles every day, for years. Would you expect the United Kingdom gfoverment to shake there heads and not retaliate?
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Posted November 20, 2012 at 8:59PM
Oh please,
Your exact words were
" Israel has an election coming up and killing Palestinian children is a vote winner"
I will leave others to draw their own conclusions.
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Posted November 20, 2012 at 10:21PM
fourm member The CNN report in your link was written by someone who has a pro-Palestine bias, and although it's an extremely interesting peace it hardly qualifies as an objective assessment of the situation.
It certainly doesn't lead me to draw the conclusion that Ahmed Jabari wanted to make peace, or that Israel "didn't want the trouble to end."
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Posted November 20, 2012 at 10:28PM
On the subject of child killing...
Both sides in this conflict have been guilty of that. Rockets fired into densely populated areas will kill whoever happens to be at the point of impact, and both sides will point a finger at the other side and say 'child killers'.
This is a conflict that is fueled by intense hatred,and although no politician is ever going to admit it, neither side cares deeply about the individuals who are killed. If they did, the rocket attacks and air strikes on civilian-populated areas would stop immediately.
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Posted November 20, 2012 at 11:11PM
I think that you could safely remove the word "deeply" from the above posting and still be accurate
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Posted November 21, 2012 at 8:50AM
"in Israeli politics you don't lose votes by killing children, as long as they are Palestinian. "
I don't very often agree with fourm member, or much press comment, but that is not bigotry but a sad, undeniable, fact.
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Posted November 21, 2012 at 9:28AM
As I have stated on many of these Middle East conflicts, you have to know the people, their history and their politics, and not really solely on media reports. Perhaps a long term visit to some of these countries, and getting to know the people would be a starting point for a true debate?.
It also concerns me, how some forum members constantly complain about the press and newspaper articles, and how people should not take much notice of these reports, especially highlighting certain publishers and reporters, then backtrack and use these same reports when it suits their arguments!.
I note in this mornings news, Hilary Clinton is now involved in mediation, with all parties.
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Posted November 21, 2012 at 10:48AM
fourm member
You are correct that I do not know the members of this forum, but one thing that I do know is there is nothing like knowing and experiencing local knowledge and experiences first hand, and not solely quoting media articles as the true facts, when the media item obviously suits the member or person possible debating skills.
Perhaps a subject that I didn't want to mention, but you seem to have brought it into this thread, is child killing. This will always happen or is likely to happen in any conflicts on all sides, where ever in the world. Yet there doesn't seem to be much mention about child deaths that occur every minute or hour of every day due to bad sanitation and poverty?.
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Posted November 21, 2012 at 10:56AM
The parallels with Ireland are legion.
It comes down to intolerant Religionists and long, long grudges/memories.
If there really was a God, he/she would sort them out.
[b]IMHO[/b] - If God exists he/she is unlikely to care whether you're Moslem, Catholic, Protestant, Sikh, Buddhist, or even a 7th Day Adventist, so long as you behave yourself.
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Posted November 21, 2012 at 1:56PM
spuds
I don't claim to 'know' Israel well - I've been there twice. I do know some Israelis pretty well however, and I've heard their point of view explained ad nauseam.
The truth is, there are old grudges on both sides, and they go back a very long way. As with all long-running conflicts there are people on both sides who shout loud, but have no personal recollections of the decades of smouldering that go to create these outbreaks of fighting.
There will be mediation and diplomacy aplenty, and at some point there will be an uneasy cease-fire. Perhaps it will hold, perhaps it will not. Eventually however, there will be another confrontation, and the whole sorry cycle will be repeated, or so history tells us.
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