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Excessive Force?


oresome

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Alan Duncan, a former Cabinet Minister, has said householders should not be prosecuted for defending their homes after a couple were arrested following the shooting of two suspected burglars.

Whilst I have some sympathy with the householders as it is claimed they had suffered several thefts, I cannot condone their action unless they were being physically threatened and felt their lives were in danger.

The only way to establish if the use of a gun was appropriate is in a court and politics should be left out of it.

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LanceAlot

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I don't think I can add much to this debate, only to say I heard on the news about the armed police officers who shot and killed a youth who was a 'suspected' armed gang member. He was shot six times as soon as the police car drew alongside the suspect car without,apparently, a warning having been given.

I can't fail to miss the irony when that situation is compared with a householder who fired both barrels at the dead of night when four criminals entered his property. I don't know if he gave a warning before firing, but perhaps that is the crux of the matter in both cases and that's why he was arrested. The latter did not, however, shoot to kill as two of them had non life-threatening injuries.

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WhiteTruckMan

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Under the circumstances being discussed here, I don't happen to believe in a proportional and/or reasonable response. That sounds to me like the authorities would be happier if it was a fair fight with an intruder(s). Well I dont happen to believe in a fair fight either. If overwhelming force means that I am sucessfull in defending myself then thats what I will use. After all, thats exactly what the police use.

Speaking of which, I might add that the police cannot protect or defend you. The best that they will do is come along afterwards and pick up the pieces.

WTM

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Aitchbee

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Just off subject a little...' excessive force ' that is, the murdering of 40 people and the serious maiming of hundreds of black workers (to the detriment and anguish of thousands more) who decided to 'go on strike' was used by the Police in South Africa.A British company, partly owns the platinum mines.

The South African Police are accountable [are serial murderers]...they pulled the triggers....that is a fact.

The black people of South Africa are still treated as dirt by their white masters.

And British Companies (in South Africa) turn a blind eye to the massacres.

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WhiteTruckMan

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Aitchbee

Interesting, (and an event that I personally was aware of) but I fail to see the relevance to this thread?

WTM

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wee eddie

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Aitchbee: I know what you are talking about but your accessment of the Politics is way off line.

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bremner

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...and there was me thinking the black ANC South African government was led by Jacob Zuma whilst Aitchbee clearly thinks it is F.W De Klerk

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spuds

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In my 'travelling days' from the 1960's onward, I visited many countries where 'self protection' was paramount, and having legal or illegal access to firearms was a easy (including for foreign guests). Seeing barricaded homes and an array of armoury at that time, made me truly think that I would hate the day, the UK would become likewise. To me its heading that way, and all the statistics for this not happening is becoming less convincing.

The people and the area involved in this recent incident, are known to me, and the ongoing investigations are revealing quite a lot about what as occurred, and what might occur. One thing that as come to light, is that the property as been burgled previously on a number of occasions.

There have been an increase of early morning visits to people's homes by ruthless people, but most go unreported by the national press. In my own location, we have seen an increase in this activity, with people being badly beaten, and this includes people in their 70's. Only last year, there was an incident, when one of my younger neighbours's woke up to find four armed intruder's in their home at 1.30am. The intruder's have never been caught, even though the property had CCTV, and the young neighbour's have since left their home because of the trauma, leaving their property on a let basis.

I also notice that when a post like this starts, the usual 'shoot in the back' Tony Martin remarks appear. Tony Martin was originally convicted of Murder which was later quashed, and reduced to Manslaughter. If some of the people who give their own expert views about Tony Martin, would perhaps care or bother to look at the court transcripts and photo/video evidence of this case, then they might consider that the 'shoot in the back' and other evidence and supposedly newspaper published articles might not be true in using these obtained articles in the way they try to express their drama views and opinions?.  

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bremner

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The couple will face no prosecution CPS decision

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oresome

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If the views on this forum were reflected in a jury room and learning a little more of the circumstances, ( they were confronted in their bedroom by a masked intruder ), I doubt very much that they would have been convicted if it had gone to court.

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Aitchbee

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fm - I have just read your last post 8 times very slowly ...I can't understand the logic perhaps because there is no logic involved .

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