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PM (millionaire)says it morally wrong (tax avoidance)


Chegs ®™

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I'm pretty sure the PM will have accountants who's remit will include reducing his tax bill,so for him to publicly state that "tax avoidance,though legal is morally wrong" must be hoping that these celebrities will hear him & decide "Oh,its morally wrong so I'll cough up big wedges of my earnings" I very much doubt it Mr Cameron,they're much more likely to decide,sod the UK & depart for elsewhere taking their money with them.I also expect that Jimmy Carr will use this statement from the PM as the basis for some humourous sketch or joke,that Gary Barlow & other members of the band will setup home in the USA(probably in the same suburb as the Beckhams)

If you were extremely well off,what would you do?

I would find another country to live in,where the weather is nicer more often & only return to the UK for family visits.

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spider9

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fourm member

It's absolutely nothing to do with 'telling the truth', the PM was just wrong to personalise it, and if he'd said he wouldn't comment on an individual case because he didn't have enough detail then he wouldn't have been lying, either.

You are wrong on both counts, I'm afraid.

... and the comparison with ISAs is ludicrous!

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Forum Editor

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This business of tax avoidance suddenly seems to have become a cause célèbre, but of course it's not a new practice - people have been using legal avoidance measures ever since income tax first saw the light of day.

All of a sudden we seem to have turned into a nation of moral judges, but I imagine that - if we were suddenly to become rich - we might all instruct our accountants to take whatever legal measures necessary to ensure that we minimised our tax liabilities. Indeed, plenty of self-employed people do it without waiting to become rich - it's normal good accounting practice.

There are of course certain high-profile cases that have come to the notice of the press, and are therefore public knowledge. I imagine that much of the over the top outrage being expressed here, and in the media is as much the result of jealousy as of anything else.

It's the job of HMRC to detect and investigate the use of loopholes in the tax laws, and - should they think it in the public interest - to ask Ministers to make changes in those laws. It's no good blaming taxpayers if they walk through an open gate.

David Cameron was foolish to make his 'immoral' statement about the Jimmy Carr case, but then he's rapidly distinguishing himself as a Prime Minister who shoots from the hip and regrets it later. It isn't the job of a Prime Minister (or of any Minister) to lecture the population about morality.

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Chegs ®™

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It isn't the job of a Prime Minister (or of any Minister) to lecture the population about morality.

I cou;dn't agree more,particularly when not so very long ago it was revealed that way too many politicians were discovered fiddling their expenses as the rules said it was allowed.They did offer to repay after the country was in uproar,but that didn't make it morally correct they'd fleeced the taxpayer in the first place.Cameron's government has also offered to become the nations Nanny sending texts to parents and offering parenting classes.This personal attack may well return & bite him on the butt(I hope it does)If he is unhappy that tax avoidance occurs,then he is in the perfect position to introduce laws that stop it and sitting with a journalist in an office in Mexico is not what I meant by "perfect position".

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carver

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fourm member I think your idea about tax avoidance may be seriously warped, for a start ISA's are normally invested in by people who have already paid tax on their earnings. This is called investing your money and because you are *investing * it for a long time you get a better return on your money with the blessing of the tax man.

*Tax Avoidances * is where you get your earnings and shove them outside the country or into a scheme that helps to avoid paying tax, perfectly legal and Cameron's father even did it, so for Cameron to have a morality outrage over some one else doing the same thing is a bit dumb.

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morddwyd

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"*Tax Avoidances * is where you get your earnings and shove them outside the country or into a scheme that helps to avoid paying tax, "

Rubbish, it is what it is, avoiding paying unnecessary tax.

For years I claimed shaving expenses against my tax, most of my contemporaries did not.

That does not make me immoral, it simply makes them foolish.

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spider9

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fourm member "So the only reason for condemning K2 but not ISAs is jealousy."

Right on cue, when your argument is weak pull out the 'you're jealous' rabbit from the hat!!

ISAs are extremely limited in how much you can put in, and they cannot be used to bring your tax on earnings down to 1% as the K2 scheme appears to be able to do - so comparison IS ludicrous.

But , as usual, you introduce these 'deflections' away from your pathetic defence of the PM.

My original post appears to have general agreement (certainly on QT and 'This week', last night) with the pundits all saying Cameron was unwise, although a very uncomfortable Ken Clarke dodged the bullet! And the phrase I used about Miliband being more statesmanlike was used, verbatim! Such partisan comments.....should they really be allowed?? (:-O)

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namtas

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I don't believe that this has anything to do with jealously as FE suggests, yes we would all like to keep more of what we earn.

The ordinary UK public see themselves doing their duty and paying taxes necessary to run the country and they would I guess be OK with this if not all wishing they paid less.

Then they contrast their situation with those who have a bit more money and see these as being able to gain a advantage because they can afford to do it, they see this as unfair and unequal.

It is about fairnesses to all.

Is a person jealous because they want to feel to be equal treated? Idon't think so.

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spider9

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fourm member

"Actually, they should be pleased. If he'd simply been paying all the tax he could, the ticket prices would have been higher."

Even for you, that's hilarious, yet bounding on the ridiculous!

Not even remotely justifying any of your pontifications.

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spider9

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fourm member

"Not having any political affiliation my only interest..."

Your protestations are really reaching new heights (or perhaps it should be lows!), you have long been Tory central office's major mouthpiece on this Forum.

Once again however, I must correct your misquotes, I said that Miliband's response to this particular matter was more statesmanlike than the PM's - surely even you can see the difference?

FE was nearer the truth when he said Cameron has a habit of opening his mouth before engaging the brain, yet you seem to be the only one now blaming the 'media' for laying a trap!!

But then, as you tell us, you have no political affiliations, except it seems hating all things Labour, which is a perfectly honourable position to take if only you would be honest enough to declare it.

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john bunyan

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forum member

"ISAs are a way of investing money without paying tax on the interest earned.

That makes them tax avoidance. It is really that simple."

On this occasion I disagree with you. The interest on ISA's is not taxable, so no avoidance arises.Certain allowances are also non taxable - Attendance allowance, for example, and War Widow's pension. Avoidance would arise if the item were taxable and you found a legal way to avoid paring it.

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